Watchmen V

[Corel]

And here it is again folks!

I've spied the trailer for Japan which shows some additional footage (http://www.traileraddict.com/trailer/watchmen/japanese-trailer).

It's interesting to see that the trailer shown seems to show more of a political angle than some of the more action packed trailers released.

[Seil]

Well the comic is told from more of a political angle. It'll be interesting to see the film, and whether all the action trailers are there for the sake of roping in movie goers or if it's an actual superhero action blockbuster.

[Sky Warrior Bob]

No snappy title? Like Watchman V: Who will get to watch the Watchman, not get watched?

Or has that Fox lawsuit already been resolved yet? I haven't been paying close attention...

SWB

[Corel]

No snappy title? Like Watchman V: Who will get to watch the Watchman, not get watched?

Or has that Fox lawsuit already been resolved yet? I haven't been paying close attention...

SWB

Well I was thinking of posting a giant picture of Rocky, for the Roman Numeral V always reminds me of that blasphemous film. So I thought the title would suffice!

Mm, the entire last thread is about the lawsuit. It turns out Fox won, but the result of this is unknown at the moment.

[Invisible Queen]

Next time we could do something related to this picture:
http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/359/topten0222blindjusticeip2.jpg
(It's from Top Ten, also by Alan Moore.)

[Corel]

Video diary about The Minutemen. (http://www.empireonline.com/video/watchmen-minutemen-journal/)

I still do love how cheesy their costumes look. It never really stood out in the book as a result of my desensitisation for people prancing around in their underwear in the Comic medium, but on the big screen they do look rather silly!

[Premonitions]

Oh that's awesome, I somehow always felt that hooded justice's costume was more intimidating than the others, because he was the first, and everyone else was just embelishing on his idea, it's weird to see him look goofy. also
"Who watches the simpsons"? hahahaa

[Corel]

Light, I shed it.

This was wrote by one of the producers of Watchmen.


Watchmen. A producer's perspective.

An open letter.

Who is right? In the Watchmen dispute between Warner Brothers and Fox that question is being discussed, analyzed, argued, tried and ruled on in a court of law. That's one way to answer the question - It is a fallback position in our society for parties in conflict to resolve disputes. And there are teams of lawyers and a highly regarded Federal Judge trying to do just that, which obviates any contribution I could make towards answering the "who is right" question within a legal context. But after 15 plus years of involvement in the project, and a decade more than that working in the movie business, I have another perspective, a personal perspective that I believe important to have on the public record.

No one is more keenly aware of the irony of this dispute than Larry Gordon and I who have been trying to get this movie made for many years. There's a list of people who have rejected the viability of a movie based on Alan Moore and Dave Gibbon's classic graphic novel that reads like a who's who of Hollywood.

We've been told the graphic novel is unfilmable.

After 9/11 some felt the story's themes were too close to reality ever to be palatable to a mainstream audience.

There were those who considered the project but who wished it were somehow different: Could it be a buddy movie, or a team-up movie or could it focus on one main character; did it have to be so dark; did so many people have to die; could it be stripped of its flashback structure; could storylines be eliminated; could new storylines be invented; did it have to be so long; could the blue guy put clothes on... The list of dissatisfactions for what Watchmen is was as endless as the list of suggestions to make it something it never was.

Also endless are the list of studio rejections we accrued over the years. Larry and I developed screenplays at five different studios. We had two false starts in production on the movie. We were involved with prominent and commercial directors. Big name stars were interested. In one instance hundreds of people were employed, sets were being built - An A-list director and top artists in the industry were given their walking papers when the studio financing the movie lost faith.

After all these years of rejection, this is the same project, the same movie, over which two studios are now spending millions of dollars contesting ownership. Irony indeed, and then some.

Through the years, inverse of the lack of studio faith has been the passionate belief by many many individuals - movie professionals who were also passionate fans of the graphic novel - who, yes, wanted to work on the film, but more for reasons of just wanting to see the movie get made, to see this movie get made and made right, donated their time and talent to help push the film forward: Writers gave us free screenplay drafts; conceptual art was supplied by illustrators, tests were performed gratis by highly respected actors and helped along and put together by editors, designers, prop makers and vfx artists; we were the recipients of donated studio and work space, lighting and camera equipment. Another irony, given the commercial stakes implied by the pitched legal dispute between Fox and Warners, is that for years Watchmen has been a project that has survived on the fumes of whatever could be begged, borrowed and stolen - A charity case for all intents and purposes. None of that effort, none of that passion and emotional involvement, is considered in the framework of this legal dispute.

From my point of view, the flashpoint of this dispute, came in late spring of 2005. Both Fox and Warner Brothers were offered the chance to make Watchmen. They were submitted the same package, at the same time. It included a cover letter describing the project and its history, budget information, a screenplay, the graphic novel, and it made mention that a top director was involved.

And it's at this point, where the response from both parties could not have been more radically different.

The response we got from Fox was a flat "pass." That's it. An internal Fox email documents that executives there felt the script was one of the most unintelligible pieces of shit they had read in years. Conversely, Warner Brothers called us after having read the script and said they were interested in the movie - yes, they were unsure of the screenplay, and had many questions, but wanted to set a meeting to discuss the project, which they promptly did. Did anyone at Fox ask to meet on the movie? No. Did anyone at Fox express any interest in the movie? No. Express even the slightest interest in the movie? Or the graphic novel? No.

From there, the executives at Warner Brothers, who weren't yet completely comfortable with the movie, made a deal to acquire the movie rights and we all started to creatively explore the possibility of making Watchmen. We discussed creative approaches and started offering the movie to directors, our former director having moved on by then. After a few director submissions, Zack Snyder came onboard, well before the release of his movie 300. In fact, well before its completion. This was a gut, creative call by Larry, me and the studio... Zack didn't have a huge commercial track record, yet we all felt he was the right guy for the movie.

Warner Brothers continued to support, both financially and creatively, the development of the movie. And eventually, after over a year of work, they agreed to make the film, based on a script that, for what it's worth, was by and large very similar to the one Fox initially read and deemed an unintelligible piece of shit.

Now here's the part that has to be fully appreciated, if for nothing more than providing insight into producing movies in Hollywood: The Watchmen script was way above the norm in length, near 150 pages, meaning the film could clock in at close to 3 hours, the movie would not only be R rated but a hard R - for graphic violence and explicit sex - would feature no stars, and had a budget north of $100M. We also asked Warner Brothers to support an additional 1 to 1.5 hours of content incurring additional cost that would tie in with the movie but only be featured in DVD iterations of the film. Warners supported the whole package and I cannot begin to emphasize how ballsy and unprecedented a move this was on the part of a major Hollywood studio. Unheard of. And would another studio in Hollywood, let alone a studio that didn't show one shred of interest in the movie, not one, have taken such a risk? Would they ever have made such a commitment, a commitment to a film that defied all conventional wisdom?

Only the executives at Fox can answer that question. But if they were to be honest, their answer would have to be "No."

Shouldn't Warner Brothers be entitled to the spoils - if any -- of the risk they took in supporting and making Watchmen? Should Fox have any claim on something they could have had but chose to neither support nor show any interest in?

Look at it another way... One reason the movie was made was because Warner Brothers spent the time, effort and money to engage with and develop the project. If Watchmen was at Fox the decision to make the movie would never have been made because there was no interest in moving forward with the project.

Does a film studio have the right to stand in the way of an artistic endeavor and determine that it shouldn't exist? If the project had been sequestered at Fox, if Fox had any say in the matter, Watchmen simply wouldn't exist today, and there would be no film for Fox to lay claim on. It seems beyond cynical for the studio to claim ownership at this point.

By his own admission, Judge Feess is faced with an extremely complex legal case, with a contradictory contractual history, making it difficult to ascertain what is legally right. Are there circumstances here that are more meaningful, which shed light on what is ultimately just, to be taken into account when assessing who is right? In this case, what is morally right, beyond the minutiae of decades-old contractual semantics, seems clear cut.

For the sake of the artists involved, for the hundreds of people, executives and filmmakers, actors and crew, who invested their time, their money, and dedicated a good portion of their lives in order to bring this extraordinary project to life, the question of what is right is clear and unambiguous - Fox should stand down with its claim.

My father, who was a lawyer and a stickler for the minutiae of the law, was always quick to teach me that the determination of what is right and wrong was not the sole purview of the courts. I bet someone at Fox had a parent like mine who instilled the same sense of fairness and justice in them.

Lloyd Levin


Link to article. (http://www.hitfix.com/blogs/2008-12-6-motion-captured/posts/2009-1-8-an-open-letter-from-watchmen-producers)

[Mirai Gen]

He has a good point. But honestly so does Fox.

I've been trying to make up my mind about this movie's legal situation because I feel agreement with both sides.

[Kaneda]

He does have a point, and there seems to be more evidence that Fox really wasn't going to do anything at all with the property, and that they actively rejected the idea. But it doesn't come close to negating Fox's ground, and the judge already seems to be rather annoyed with Lawrence Gordon.

I'm not entirely sure what Lloyd Levin is hoping to accomplish with that letter, as I was under the impression that at this point they're just trying to reach a settlement.

Also...
Good news everybody!

Moviegoers may get to watch the "Watchmen" after all.
Attorneys for rival studios fighting over the release of the superhero flick told a federal judge on Friday that they're having fruitful settlement talks.
Attorneys for 20th Century Fox and Warner Bros. asked the judge to delay a hearing Friday so those discussions can continue over the weekend.
U.S. District Judge Gary Allen Feess agreed to continue the hearing but says a trial over whether to block the film's March release is still set for Jan. 20.
Lou Karasik, who is representing Fox, told Feess that the delay would be "very, very helpful" to settlement discussions he deemed "productive."
Friday's revelation surprised Feess, who noted that Warner Bros. had been seeking to move up the Jan. 20 trial to next week, citing the film's marketing campaign and its March 6 release date.
-Associated Press (http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5i-Ob09KjHGyZUJmKGnRlOOAZgAYQD95JPTF00)

[Mirai Gen]

I'm glad. However...
Good news to everybody!
...everyone but SS and Fifth, anyway.

[Meister]

Who watches the Watchmen? We will!
I want to watch the Watchmen
Fox keeping us from watching the Watchmen
Moviegoers may get to watch the Watchmen after all
This shit right there is why I care for the idea of a Watchmen movie less and less.

[Mirai Gen]

Unless I'm mistaken you called it pretty hard too right about the time the movie had it's first trailer.

[Smarty McBarrelpants]

I'm glad. However...

...everyone but SS and Fifth, anyway.

Hey now. I've shovelled as much crap on this idea as anyone.

[Meister]

Unless I'm mistaken you called it pretty hard too right about the time the movie had it's first trailer.
Yeah. :(

I think the first quote was even supposed to be my line from back then. What can I say except, hindsight.

[NonCon]

Hey now. I've shovelled as much crap on this idea as anyone.

Yeah, but you hate everything, even more than Fifth, so you're sort of a given.

[Mike McC]

I've got dissent over the idea, too, though I've only voiced "Fox is in the right here, guys" statements.

[Krylo]

This shit right there is why I care for the idea of a Watchmen movie less and less.

But if we don't watch the Watchmen, who will?

[Kaneda]

But if we don't watch the Watchmen, who will?

http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/image/Watcher_2.jpg

And critics I guess.

[NonCon]

No (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ntztIUtCv0&fmt=22)

[TheSparrow]

No (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ntztIUtCv0&fmt=22)

What in the HELL was that?

[NonCon]

One of the worst trailers I have seen in my entire life.

[Lumenskir]

One of the worst trailers I have seen in my entire life
?

It didn't look remarkably different from the other slo-mo trailers released so far.

[NonCon]

"You've never seen superheroes like this."

That trailer basically summed up everything I had been afraid the Watchmen movie would be.

[The Wizard Who Did It]

?

It didn't look remarkably different from the other slo-mo trailers released so far.
I think the tag line was mostly what killed it.

[BitVyper]

The whole attitude that the trailer is presented with does it.

[TheSparrow]

The whole attitude that the trailer is presented with does it.

Exactly....the full trailers had the slo-mo and such, but this was targeted pretty much as "300 style badassery, come watch!" That television commercial makes me almost not want to see the movie at all.

[BitVyper]

Oh well. Trailers do stupid things all the time. We'll see about the movie itself when it comes out. My money is on it being a decent enough movie, but a terrible adaptation.

[Mirai Gen]

Oh well. Trailers do stupid things all the time.

Such as several of the trailers for Star Wars Ep II, which were Hey Yoda Fights With His Lightsaber In This One, For Realz, It's So Cool.

EDIT: That trailer wouldn't be so bad if it didn't have the 300-esque shredding guitar riffs.

[Meister]

You've never seen superheroes like this.
That's a perfectly valid way to describe Watchmen.

[NonCon]

It is, but the trailer tries to make it sound like more badass, rather than more human, interesting superheroes, and the imagery they chose to go with it just furthers that feel. If maybe they had those same lines with an image of the Comedian crying or Doc Manhattan yelling at the the television people, I could forgive it.

[BitVyper]

"You've never seen heroes like this."

'Cause I always got the distinct feeling that each of them was very similar to another mainstream superhero.... almost as if they were based on other characters that the author couldn't use for his story...

Shows how much I know.

[Masked Jedi]

Look at it this way. Watchmen may be the best selling graphic novel of the year, but the majority of the people seeing this movie prolly won't be comic nerds. To them, this is new: they have never seen superheroes with this design, who are this scummy and ambiguous.

And yeah, NonCon, it does try to make it seem more badass, but isn't that what trailers do? Also, i'd advise to go reread Watchmen. The badass quotient is turned up to 11 in that book.

[Mirai Gen]

That's a perfectly valid way to describe Watchmen.

Watchmen is a Zack Snyder movie.

Zack Snyder did 300.

300 had shredding guitar riffs during what can best be described as 'badass moments'.

It might just be the association but when Hollywood says "You've never seen superheroes like this," I do not instantly think "as human beings with their own philosophical and moral beliefs and trappings."

[Kaneda]

It's a TV spot, its not aiming for the same crowd the trailers were. Of course a TV spot's going to be much more lowest common denominator.

[Meister]

'Cause I always got the distinct feeling that each of them was very similar to another mainstream superhero.... almost as if they were based on other characters that the author couldn't use for his story...
Well, yes, but this trailer's target group most likely never heard of Captain Atom or the Question.

Whoever ends up seeing this first in theaters: I hope you realize just how much everyone's gonna bug you about if Watchmen is just another action-flick-with-a-plot-twist or not.

[TheSparrow]

I might attempt to get my brother to sneak me in when he assembles the film and test runs it :D

[BitVyper]

Well, yes, but this trailer's target group most likely never heard of Captain Atom or the Question.


This trailer's target group shouldn't be a target group at all.

[Corel]

Breaker breaker. Green light! Green light! (http://www.empireonline.com/news/story.asp?NID=24014)

[Mirai Gen]

We Shall Watch The Watchmen
Okay, great!

Now let's not ever make an article title like that again, okay?

[NonCon]

Can I watch people watch the Watchmen? And could, in theory, someone watch me watching the Watchmen watchers?

[Meister]

You can do your part to avoid dragging an old philosophical statement down to internet meme level is what you can do.

[Kerensky287]

You can do your part to avoid dragging an old philosophical statement down to internet meme level is what you can do.

Too late, man. What's done is done.

Now, let's just hope that watching the Watchmen doesn't suck as badly as some of us anticipate it might... I mean, movies based on comic books SOMETIMES do well, but this is one comic book that was more based on psychological stuff than action and also hasn't been updated in decades. I'm not sure how Cold War mentality translates to modern-day activities.

[Mirai Gen]

You can do your part to avoid dragging an old philosophical statement down to internet meme level is what you can do.

What's ironic is that the internet didn't do it this time.

[Kaneda]

The official site (http://watchmenmovie.warnerbros.com/) has been updated, and is pretty nifty. There's a lot of audio clips on each of the pages, each character has a full line of dialogue which is neato. Also there's clips from the soundtrack which makes me happy, as I was worried it would be RAWKIN EXTREME, seeing as it's the guy who did 300.

So this confirmed pretty much the entirety of Rorschach's first journal entry, as well as Ozymandias being inspired by Alexander the Great.

[TheSparrow]

The official site (http://watchmenmovie.warnerbros.com/) has been updated, and is pretty nifty. There's a lot of audio clips on each of the pages, each character has a full line of dialogue which is neato. Also there's clips from the soundtrack which makes me happy, as I was worried it would be RAWKIN EXTREME, seeing as it's the guy who did 300.

So this confirmed pretty much the entirety of Rorschach's first journal entry, as well as Ozymandias being inspired by Alexander the Great.

PLUS for those who hadn't read The movie will be coming out, and on time even (http://www.watchmencomicmovie.com/011509-watchmen-fox-%20wb-lawsuit-dismissed.php)

Fox gets 10 million upfront and somewhere between 5% and 8.5% Gross, depending on revenues, and Fox gets Gross in any and all future sequels/spinoffs (hahaha).

Fox won't be distributing either.

[Kerensky287]

Alright! Now all we have to do is watch wait and hope it doesn't suck as bad as it could.

I like Rorschach's voice more now that I've heard more than the single line of dialogue. I thought he was too action hero-y at first, but now it seems to me more like he's angry; my original vision of his voice was more neutral, more psychotic, but this one is good too - it translates his "Justice at any cost" mentality well.

As for the other characters, I REALLY like Dr Manhattan's previews (he has that Godlike "fondly regard creation" feel), Nite-Owl sounds a little too sure of himself and Ozymandias appears a little too obviously "evil" despite only technically being a villain in the book.

[TheSparrow]

The Japanese Trailer (http://www.watchmencomicmovie.com/010609-japanese-watchmen-movie-trailer.php) presents a different feel from the U.S. Trailers I've seen so far. A bit more of the politics. Making me more comfortable with the possibilities here.

[Kaneda]

Another shitty TV Spot. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3GPSp4TAMs)

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/801/picture134cm6.png

[Mirai Gen]

Actually that one was much better than the last.

Also I've stopped hating on these TV spots simply based on the fact that they're just trying to get them into the theater. Like if I was a marketing rep and someone was making the Watchmen movie and came to me I'd go, okay, let's make this movie look as generic superhero movie as possible.

[Kaneda]

Also, forgot to mention, but the credits song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VYHFjCXxwU) is now available.

I personally don't mind it. I think the the themes, tone, and lyrics (at midnight all the agents lolol) of Dylan's original song match well with Watchmen, while the new sound to it matches well with the fact that this is a new presentation of Watchmen.

[RickZarber]

Ew. Unless there's something visually interesting about them, I think I'll skip the credits for this one. Not the aftertaste I want. Would've much preferred the original.

[TheSparrow]

I think that Japanese Trailer I linked is my favorite so far. I dont like the TV spots at all, but I understand what the ad people were thinking. I dont agree with them, but I understand it.

[Julford Hajime]

*Is a sucker for anything MCR related*

I liked the credit song. I'm not faniliar with the original, but it's no like the MCR version was particularly bad or anything.

[TheSparrow]

That....that song was...awful...I am not an MCR fan in the firstplace, but there are rules, and you DONT DO THAT to a Bob Dylan song.

[MFD]

Here's a TV spot that has me positively grinning: NBS Nightly News (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nd5cInmK6LQ)

[Magus]

"Better Blue Than Red". Zany.

Renewed hope for the extended DVD cut's quality, anyway, although if they made all this kind of stuff part of the actual narrative the film would be what, 4.5 hours?

[Smarty McBarrelpants]

I think the most amzing thing was the Youtube comments.
The first Youtube comments have people pretending this was real with some actual degree of thought and wit in their posts. I'm amazed.

[Kaneda]

Rorschach and Dan talking. (http://movies.sky.com/new-watchmen-clip)

Riot. (http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&VideoID=52225217)

Dan (instead of Rorschach) meets with Veidt. (http://video.msn.com/video.aspx?mkt=en-us&vid=f415cb4c-5e1a-435c-9386-5f966fa41e7f&from=&fg=rss)

Also, I saw the first 20 minutes of the movie, as well as the scene with Rorschach and the oil in prison, so if anyone has questions about that, go ahead and ask I suppose.

[Meister]

Hmmmm.

Not bad. Judging from those clips the film seems to do a good job avoiding the usual "larger than life" depiction that so many similar movies apparently can't shake. If the rest of the movie pulls that off consistently, we might have something here.

Not entirely sure what's supposed to be going on with Veidt though, he sounds pretty drunk.

[Mirai Gen]

I think I'm going to pass on viewing those and just hold out the remaining month or so. I mean I already know the plot and what's going to happen but I just get this feeling it'll do me more harm than good viewing parts of it now.

[Corel]

Spartan of the Caribbean trailer released. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zUgBK0-qbo)


Not entirely sure what's supposed to be going on with Veidt though, he sounds pretty drunk.

Drunk on power?

[Arhra]

Drunk on EVIL.

It'll be good to see how this turns out. I wonder what they decided to do with the ending.

[BitVyper]

Jesus, I like this Veidt less and less every time I see him. He looks less like a Nietzschean superman and more like he needs a decent meal, and now his voice... it sounds like the actor was maybe going for snobbish/cultured, but like Meister said, he just sounds drunk.

If nothing else, I think they've really nailed Dan. He looks almost perfect. He's missing the weight though, and that kind of sucks. I'm liking Rorschach's voice more than I did before too. It's not quite what I'd really like, but it sounds appropriate now, and not like he needs a lozenge.

[Magus]

I think the guy's trying to do Veidt with some slight German accent that's screwing up his pronunciations and making him hard to understand.

In my head Veidt always spoke perfect cultured Oxford-accented English, no matter where it was he immigrated from, because Veidt's capacity for language would allow him to speak whatever language he is speaking flawlessly (and of course he would know ten or more, 'cause he's Veidt).

I like that Rorschach is short. I think that's important to the character.

[Kaneda]

It's a GermanxEnglish sort of accent that Goode's giving Veidt, but only in the more private scenes. In the more public scenes, he has Veidt speaking with an American accent.

I'm not too fond of it, and a bunch of people will probably think it's just being inconsistent.

[BitVyper]

I could even go for that if it weren't for the fact that just everything about Veidt seems wrong so far. Maybe the actor will come through anyway, but I think it was just a shitty casting decision.

[Meister]

Spartan of the Caribbean trailer released. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zUgBK0-qbo)
that completes the Watchmen experience
So what this tells me is if I go to the movie theater, I'll have an incomplete experience. And anti-piracy PSAs tell me if I watch pirated movies I get an incomplete experience. That... may not be the best marketing move.

[Kaneda]

I don't quite get this perception that extended editions = bad. Maybe, sometimes, a production company might not be so keen on the idea of a four hour movie. That's where the DVD comes in, and most people probably won't mix up the whole concept of a director's cut with "it's ok to watch the movie online." I don't quite see how anyone would come to that conclusion at all.

[Magus]

Besides which the animation isn't as good as it could be. They should've went for the best animation available.

I know I sure won't be buying this as a separate DVD, as Tales of the Black Freighter is supplemental to Watchmen's story, commenting upon it, and I really don't think it works as "separate". So hopefully they splice it into the full movie on a director's edition DVD.

[Meister]

Oh no, I love extended editions (well, when they're a director's cut or something, rather than a cheap cash-in). It's just, the argument most of those PSAs use is "you'll get the complete experience in theaters only, so downloading is a bad idea." So far, so good, only now they're basically telling me in advance I'll get the "complete" version of a movie on DVD only, so why even bother to see it in the theater anymore?

Most everyone still thinks a movie's theater version is the definitive version of that particular film, and the DVD release just gives you a method of seeing that at home. In reality between director's cuts and bonus materials on DVD and a lot of people owning large screens and 5.1 Dolby systems, movies are being made more and more for the DVD release and theater versions are becoming little more than advance screenings.

[Kaneda]

That's exceptionally true with Watchmen. Some things are being cut just so it will fit in IMAX. Hollis Mason's death for instance, and a couple related scenes, aren't going to be in the theatrical release, and will probably be in every form of the DVD. It's looking more and more like there will be no theatrical cut on DVD, and they'll start with an extended edition.

On a related note, here's a few things that have been cut or altered. Asterisk means it will be almost definitely in the DVD:
1. Veidt's Vivarium (Budget issues I think)
2. All of the Bernies dialogue* (this is the only one that I think will really detract from the film)
3. "I did it 35 minutes ago" changed to "I triggered it 35 minutes ago" (lolwat)
4. Mason's death.*

2 hours, 37 minutes runtime.

[Mirai Gen]

"I triggered it 35 minutes ago" (lolwat)
Awesome, no meme to cash in on.

[Kaneda]

http://www.totalfilm.com/reviews/cinema/watchmen

http://timesonline.typepad.com/blockbuster_buzz/2009/02/watchmen-first.html

http://movies.ign.com/articles/956/956111p1.html

http://www.coolshite.net/review/2009/02/24/watchmen-movie-review/

http://www.scifitv.com.au/Blog/2009/02/Watchmen-Review

I want to go in with relatively low or just average expectations, but that's getting pretty difficult.


(Also a neg (http://hollywood-elsewhere.com/2009/02/staggering_fail.php), though there is a certain vibe one gets that he's just pissed at Matt Selman)

[TheSparrow]

(Also a neg (http://hollywood-elsewhere.com/2009/02/staggering_fail.php), though there is a certain vibe one gets that he's just pissed at Matt Selman)

Any time someone trumpets the acting ability of Tom Cruise, I can see it is CLEARLY a reason to throw the opinion of that person out the window.

[Magus]

Especially since Tom Cruise's, err, stature doesn't really bring to mind a Nietszchean superman (not that the current Ozymandias is doing so but I'd rather give a newcomer a chance at acting than put up with Tom Cruise's obvious mediocrity).

[Kaneda]

So the RT's (http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/watchmen/) a ways in now, and critics seem very divided on it, in a way that makes me feel that even if it isn't an enjoyable movie some aspect of it is remarkably unique... or something. Although some of the issues people have might be fixable with the director's cut.

A few articles I've seen are acting like it's gotten almost all bad reviews, which is odd seeing as they're 80% positive. Not to mention those articles all primarily quote the most terribly written of the negative reviews. (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/film-reviews/film-review-watchmen-1003945726.story)

[Magus]

Not to mention RT rates things on a "good or bad" scale as opposed to scale of how good or how bad. It can be misleading. I've seen at least one review of a movie that had the "rotten" mark which when I read the review it seemed more like they'd give it a 3 out of 5 or something.

In any case, besides Hollywood reporter, there are three other "rotten" reviews, with two complaining that it doesn't do the graphic novel justice and one calling the original graphic novel's quality into question. So I'm under the impression they aren't judging the movie on its actual merits, but how they feel about Watchmen in general, biased a bit.

[Kaneda]

Not to mention RT rates things on a "good or bad" scale as opposed to scale of how good or how bad. It can be misleading.

Of course. It's a more effective system than their "average rating" thing though, which tries to smush a bunch of different opinions and viewpoints into a single point based grade. The tomatometer gives a general consensus, and for an understanding you read the reviews.

And yah, there are some negative reviews that seem really well thought out and make good points. But the way some of them address that it's a very well made movie, but hard to like (at least two stated this directly) makes me wonder if this is a flaw in the movie, or if the movie's actually just unique to the extent that it alienates some critics.

I'm rambling stupidly now.

[Mirai Gen]

This is more or less why I'm refusing to read any reviews on the movie.

I'm just going to inevitably get my opinion swayed and I'd rather see the movie and then read the reviews to make up my mind of what I liked/didn't like. Irony of ironies.

[Meister]

So I was gonna wait until one of you guys told me how it is, turns out it actually opens in Germany one day before it does in the US. Does that put me in a position of responsibility?

... that argument about needing time for localization and marketing the publishers cited when The Dark Knight came here two months later was evidently bullshit.

[Mirai Gen]

That sounds more like comeuppance for missing out on most of the Dark Knight threads around here.
Does that put me in a position of responsibility?
You? Hah! Who would ever put you in responsibility?

That would just be crazy.

Heh. Meister in authority. Hoo!


But no tell us what you think.

[TheSparrow]

God I love looking at reviewers on RT and their backlog of reviews...it gives you an idea of their idea of a good film. One fellow (one of the ones that poorly reviewed Watchmen) gave a good review to Twilight and Speed Racer. He also gave Cloverfield (I know some of you loved it, but jesus, it was Godzilla meets Blair Witch.) a higher rating than any other film he reviewed except Dark Knight. And he gave a bad review of Be Kind Rewind. Which wasnt great but was better than some of the drivel he loved like Twilight, Cloverfield, Speed Racer, The Incredible Hulk, Quantum of Suckass...ect.

[Kaneda]

Speed Racer

You did not just go there. That movie was awesome.

[Regulus Tera]

Fuck the haters, Speed Racer was the shiznitz.

I don't know if this review has been posted yet, but here you go (http://www.somethingawful.com/d/truth-media-reviews/watchmen-review-spoilers.php) (spoilers, natch).

[Corel]

I admit that I have not been a longtime fan of Watchmen, the groundbreaking comic book series and graphic novel by acclaimed comic book creator Neil Gaiman.

If only Neverwhere was remade. :(

The film is out in five days! I better get the blue body paint on...

[Meister]

Thread's closed but this isn't really worth making a new one for already: I reserved tickets for an advance screening tomorrow, feel free to shoot me a line if there's anything you want me to keep an eye open for and absolutely have to know as fast as possible.