View Full Version : Old Nightwish vs. New Nightwish
Flarecobra
04-22-2008, 01:03 PM
OK, not too long ago, Nightwish, a Finnish symphonic metal group debuted a new lead singer, after their old one was fired. Now, I've been hearing a lot of debate over weither or not the new one really suits the group or now. I think she's quite good, and does work well with the group, however if she tries to do a couple of their older songs...well...she doesn't quite have the vocal range to pull it off in my opinion. However, they can't really phase out those songs since they've only put out a single album and one or two more songs with the new singer.
My opinion is: They're both good, with their own unique styles, and shouldn't try to emulate the other.
I'm a big fan of Tarja Turunen, but I can understand why they booted her from the group. Still, I like their old stuff better.
Mirai Gen
04-22-2008, 03:21 PM
I hate that Tarja left. She was a fantastic singer and I don't know why she went all "Solo Career And I Want More Money." Her vocal range was amazing and it practically defined Nightwish's sound.
Having said thus, Nightwish has officially changed substantially without her. Anette is a great singer and she can give Nightwish what it's missing, but there's too big of a gap to fill with Tarja gone.
Damn money whore.
Devron
04-23-2008, 09:38 AM
Tarja Turunen in combination with the band made them unique.
After they parted both lost a part of what made them awesome.
They are still good, but not as charismatic as before.
Skyshot
04-23-2008, 10:22 AM
Yeah, I like Anette well enough, but she doesn't stand out for me the way Tarja did. I don't know enough music theory to explain why that is, but I think part of it is that Anette's typical voice is so much higher-pitched than Tarja's, she sounds more like a generic teen pop star. I do remember being surprised Anette is actually six years older, since Tarja has a more "mature" sound.
However, they can't really phase out those songs since they've only put out a single album and one or two more songs with the new singer.Original Sleeping Sun versus new Sleeping Sun makes me agree. I don't know what else they've redone with Anette.
I hate that Tarja left. She was a fantastic singer and I don't know why she went all "Solo Career And I Want More Money." Her vocal range was amazing and it practically defined Nightwish's sound.
Having said thus, Nightwish has officially changed substantially without her. Anette is a great singer and she can give Nightwish what it's missing, but there's too big of a gap to fill with Tarja gone.
Damn money whore.
On October 21, 2005, Turunen was asked to leave Nightwish in an open letter by the other members of Nightwish, over a dispute that involved "a changed attitude" and increased financial interest. She responded through another open letter, which was posted on her website in both Finnish and English (although the letter can no longer be found on her website, it is available on a fan page). In February 2006, Tarja's husband Marcelo posted a message to her website addressing the situation, and asked for anyone who had questions pertaining to the issues between Tarja and the rest of the band to email him. Marcelo then posted a lengthy reply to many of the questions he had received in June 2006.
(>>)
Mirai Gen
04-23-2008, 02:31 PM
I don't know if you're agreeing with me or correcting me. But either way...
increased financial interest.
...means she wanted more money and the band said "No."
I took it as she was envisioning herself as better than the rest of the band for whatever reason, and they got fed up with it.
Mirai Gen
04-23-2008, 04:39 PM
Tis what happens when ego gets in the way of music. She pretty much killed off Nightwish, and for that I will always have no respect for her.
Not like I buy my record-label music anyway, but all the same.
You do halfta admit though, that in some ways, her ego would be justifiable on some scale - she sounded fantastic.
Um, I've not much to contribute to the discussion, but Nightwish is awesome. My favorite song is She is my sin, or maybe End of all hope.
Didn't really want to make a seperate thread for that. Or should I?
Mirai Gen
04-24-2008, 02:25 AM
Well it'd be more on-topic if you referenced which Nightwish you're referring to. But as it is, naw, this is cool.
You do halfta admit though, that in some ways, her ego would be justifiable on some scale - she sounded fantastic.
I'll partially agree - If someone is confident and somewhat arrogant about what they do and how good they are, I'll accept that because they deserve it.
Taking it to the levels of what she did are unforgivable. I'll still listen to the music but she will ever be an arrogant bitch in my mind. She could even be the nicest person in the world, but she still shattered a crucial part of one of my favorite bands, and that's just not right.
Torque
04-24-2008, 12:14 PM
I loved Nightwish with Tarja. But I just bought VIP tickets to their show in Winnipeg in one month... I personally enjoy Anette's singing much better.
No, she doesn't have Tarja's range, or her uniquely operatic sound.... But every once in awhile Tarja's operatic style just couldn't QUITE mesh with the metal. Close, but no biscuit... But I think Anette can be a lot more dynamic, and variable. Everything she's sung has meshed perfectly with the band.
I'm just glad that SO far this thread, like all the others I've seen, hasn't turned into a giant Tarja Fan-boy fest.
Mirai Gen
04-24-2008, 02:32 PM
I suppose what I liked about Tarja's working with the metal was the kind of clashing it did - The mashing of beauty with darkness. A good example of when it clashed creating a weird sort of chaotic music is Dead Gardens; a good example of when it worked well was Nemo. I loved both.
There's an Overclocked Remix song from FFX with that sort of sound to it.
Found it: This (http://www.ocremix.org/remix/OCR01017/) is the strange kind of "Darkness And Light Together" sort of thing I like. It starts at about -3:19. The dark, slow one-two of the guitar with the high, arcing vocal range of the singers.
Torque
04-24-2008, 03:13 PM
There's a difference between meshing two clashing styles into a cohesive, and enjoyable experience (a la your OCRemix) and the EVER SO SLIGHT incompatibilities between Tarja's voice and the instruments of Nightwish.
Let me give you an example....
Any time Tuomas or Marco sings.. :S
Mirai Gen
04-24-2008, 06:49 PM
There's a difference between meshing two clashing styles into a cohesive, and enjoyable experience (a la your OCRemix) and the EVER SO SLIGHT incompatibilities between Tarja's voice and the instruments of Nightwish.
I'm not calling it incompatibilities - I'm calling it differing styles being used simultaneously to make one complete song that carries both dark and light musical substance.
Another good example: The grunge singer and the lead singer in the DMC3 theme song, found here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJg6xMlwGdg), towards the end.
There's a difference between meshing two clashing styles into a cohesive, and enjoyable experience (a la your OCRemix) and the EVER SO SLIGHT incompatibilities between Tarja's voice and the instruments of Nightwish.
Let me give you an example....
Any time Tuomas or Marco sings.. :S
Hey, I like that a lot. Case in point: Nightwish's Phantom of the Opera. The male singer in that (Marco, I believe.) is unbelievably awesome and meshes well with the music in the way Mirai mentioned.
I listened to some new Nightwish stuff, without Tarja, and I must say, it doesn't have that unique Operatic Metal sound. I much prefer the old stuff.
Nemo, End of All Hope, She is my Sin, Gothic Sanctuary, Phantom of the Opera, etc. Nightwish is so great.
Torque
04-24-2008, 11:07 PM
I'm not calling it incompatibilities - I'm calling it differing styles being used simultaneously to make one complete song that carries both dark and light musical substance.
Another good example: The grunge singer and the lead singer in the DMC3 theme song, found here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJg6xMlwGdg), towards the end.
no no, I was agreeing with you. Your OC remix was a good song. Nightwish is a good band. My point was that in certain songs, for WHATEVER reason, Tarja didn't seem to be meshing with the rest of the band, and it didn't sound good.
The only thing I can think of to explain it is that Tarja's very operatic style just didn't mesh with the style of music that it was going with.
It wasn't ALL the time. just some of the time in certain songs.
Hey, you guys. (http://youtube.com/watch?v=EAsqNog7pmI)
You guys, hey.
Tarja Turunen is pretty. And she's an amazing singer.
I think we can all agree with that.
Torque
04-25-2008, 05:59 PM
Hey, you guys. (http://youtube.com/watch?v=EAsqNog7pmI)
You guys, hey.
Tarja Turunen is pretty. And she's an amazing singer.
I think we can all agree with that.
Yes, Tarja is hot. But her personality destroys that.
Yes, she is a fantastic singer. But her personality destroys that.
But damnit, I just can't get enough of Nemo
edit: but in rebuttal, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdZn7k5rZLQ&NR=1
Mirai Gen
04-25-2008, 07:05 PM
Addendum: Dead Gardens. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANe86sv9JBk) I think it's a great display of her vocal work, especially after the first chorus with "Mo-o-oh-o-ore".
Yes, Tarja is hot. But her personality destroys that.
Yes, she is a fantastic singer. But her personality destroys that.
There's more I could say but it really boils down to "QFT."
EDIT: To be clear, I wouldn't really give a shit if she was just really egotistical in person. Like if she (Completely theoretically) refused to sign autographs or personally bashed other bands for "Ripping off Nightwish's style" or other such bitch-like things. I would be totally okay with her if she did those things - the music is what I care about anyway. I don't care how stuck up she is.
But she ripped away my favorite band's original sound. That is unforgivable.
EDIT's EDIT: Yes, I know it's Phantom of the Opera video, but I don't think there is a Dead Gardens music video.
Torque
04-25-2008, 07:19 PM
There's more I could say but it really boils down to "QFT."
qft?
Mirai Gen
04-25-2008, 07:49 PM
Quoted for truth. One of the common sayings on the internet.
I guess not that common.
But damnit, I just can't get enough of Nemo
Yes.
Torque
04-25-2008, 09:24 PM
Quoted for truth. One of the common sayings on the internet.
I guess not that common.
I know what it means. What is the context in which you are using it?
Are you quoting me as being truthful, or asking me to quote my source as truth?
because you didn't really clarify
edit: Yes.
I love the guitar in that song too. Great tune.
Quote for Truth, in my experience, almost always means, at least on NPF, that they are quoting you to emphasize the inherent truth of your statement.
Torque
04-25-2008, 11:51 PM
Quote for Truth, in my experience, almost always means, at least on NPF, that they are quoting you to emphasize the inherent truth of your statement.
wah-so.. It seems everytime I see that statement it's always meaning something different :S
Stupid car-guy forums never can get their shit straight. lol
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