Doctor Houselove, or How I Learned To Stop Worrying and Love Hugh Laurie

[Seil]

I dun watch a whole lot of TV - Scrubs, House, Heroes, Lost, Doctor Who, Smallville, whatever. I don't watch TV that much. I channel surf, and every once in a while I'll stop on of those shows... but no, I'm not a regular watcher. However, I saw a bit of House the other night, and I have to say, I like this little speech:

Hello, sick people and their loved ones! In the interest of saving time and avoiding a lot of boring chitchat later, I'm Doctor Gregory House; you can call me "Greg." I'm one of three doctors staffing this clinic this morning.

This ray of sunshine is Doctor Lisa Cuddy. Doctor Cuddy runs this whole hospital, so unfortunately she's much too busy to deal with you. I am a board... certified diagnostician with a double specialty of infectious disease and nephrology. I am also the only doctor currently employed at this hospital who is forced to be here against his will.

But not to worry, because for most of you, this job could be done by a monkey with a bottle of Motrin. Speaking of which, if you're particularly annoying, you may see me reach for this: this is Vicodin. It's mine! You can't have any! And no, I do not have a pain management problem, I have a pain problem... but who knows? Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'm too stoned to tell. So, who wants me?

And I loved the heck out of it. So in an effort to broaden my horizons, I wanna talk about this show that I know nothing about.

*This quote came from the really, really big House Quotes Page. (http://www.housemdquotes.com/)

[POS Industries]

Yeah, I think Dr. Cox is a totally awesome character, too.

[bluestarultor]

House is a good anti-hero. He's snide, cunning, and overconfident, but has the skills and knowledge to back it up. You like him because while he's not warm and fuzzy, everything he does goes towards helping people.

[Smarty McBarrelpants]

Hugh Laurie is much better in "A bit of Laurie and Fry" (I think that's the title) and of course Blackadder.
House is a terribly predictable show that is the same every week but my flatmates watch it so I can tell you that Dr Cameron is smoking hot (until she died her hair anyway).

[BitVyper]

Hugh Laurie is the only thing that makes House worth watching, but my god he makes it WORTH watching.

[greed]

Hugh Laurie is the only thing that makes House worth watching, but my god he makes it WORTH watching.

I held the same thought, but this season Cutner and Taub are pretty damn good too. 13's better than Cameron as well.

[Mirai Gen]

I dunno, Scrubs is funnier for Cox and Kelso. It's not that House isn't worth watching, it's that I think that Scrubs filled up most of my Hospital Drama With Humor quota nicely.

[BitVyper]

I held the same thought, but this season Cutner and Taub are pretty damn good too. 13's better than Cameron as well.

Actually yeah, I was kind of thinking: The new teams seems like it has a lot more potential.

[Bells]

And now i'll die wishing that House did a Guest appearance in Scrubs

...you guys are jerks

[Smarty McBarrelpants]

I held the same thought, but this season Cutner and Taub are pretty damn good too. 13's better than Cameron as well.

Only if you're some kind of robot who does not know these things humans call feelings.

And while I cast scorn on House and only watch it out of duress, it is infinitely better than shit-house Scrubs with its obvious jokes, painful delivery and lack of anything actually meaningful. It's really the archetypal American sitcom and that's something you don't want to be, even if you are an American sitcom.

[Fifthfiend]

Correction: "How I Met Your Mother" is the archetypal American sitcom.

But it's got Doogie Howser in it. So that's all right.

[Smarty McBarrelpants]

Correction: "How I Met Your Mother" is the archetypal American sitcom.

But it's got Doogie Howser in it. So that's all right.

Wait... Doogie Howser MD has joined a new show? HOw have I missed this?

[TDK]

Only if you're some kind of robot who does not know these things humans call feelings.

And while I cast scorn on House and only watch it out of duress, it is infinitely better than shit-house Scrubs with its obvious jokes, painful delivery and lack of anything actually meaningful. It's really the archetypal American sitcom and that's something you don't want to be, even if you are an American sitcom.
*smacks BHS around for his slanderous lies*
There are very emotional and sad parts in Scrubs, and I daresay I am offended by your allegations. Not to mention it is hilarious.

Anyweh. House is great and Hugh Laurie is awesome.

There was an episode of Scrubs once where Dr. Cox injures his foot, and some of the interns had been talking about House because Keith learned that some disease or such is caused by something or other by watching House. So JD was thinking "...And a big showy character like house would just swoop in and save the day all at once." or something like that, so Dr. Cox walks in with his cane and states the answer to the three big problem patients everyone had in a very House-ish way, then says "And no, I'm not superman. I'm just..." He smacks his cane on the table, propelling a coffee cup into the air, which he grabs. "Dr. Cox." He walks away.

Dr. Cox is awesome.

[Delacroix]

I might have quoted Dr. Cox and recreated some of his jokes / tricks / shenanigans in real life, with equal success >.> Cox is one of the funniest characters I have met so far in a TV series.

But on the subject, though I haven't watched any House episodes save for one part, which coincidentally was the bit Seil quoted, House strikes me as "Scrubs with a lot more drama, slightly less comedy, & just one character: Cox".

[Mike McC]

House isn't always predictable. Yeah, there are predictible ones, but that's not to say they don't throw a curve ball in there now and again. That's not why you watch House, though. You tune in for pretty much the same reason you'd watch Perry Mason or Columbo. It's the trip to the inevitable conclusion that's the real draw, especially the interactions between the characters.

Also, I would say neither Scrubs nor How I Met Your Mother are archetypal American sitcoms. For that, you need to look at the other CBS sitcoms, namely Two And A Half Men, and The New Adventures Of Old Christine.

[POS Industries]

And now i'll die wishing that House did a Guest appearance in Scrubs

...you guys are jerks
Eh, they already covered it. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5cSHrA9PNM)

[BitVyper]

especially the interactions between the characters.

Eh, like I said; this season is better, but pretty much everything previously has been held up almost entirely by Hugh Laurie. Whoever plays Wilson is helping too. I didn't find any member of the previous team particularly interesting except when they were getting shot down by House.

Also: Scrubs is fantastic.

[Smarty McBarrelpants]

House isn't always predictable. Yeah, there are predictible ones, but that's not to say they don't throw a curve ball in there now and again. That's not why you watch House, though. You tune in for pretty much the same reason you'd watch Perry Mason or Columbo. It's the trip to the inevitable conclusion that's the real draw, especially the interactions between the characters.

Also, I would say neither Scrubs nor How I Met Your Mother are archetypal American sitcoms. For that, you need to look at the other CBS sitcoms, namely Two And A Half Men, and The New Adventures Of Old Christine.

The reason I singled out Scrubs is because it takes the whole improbable punchlines and set up gags that are the features of American sitcom to an extreme, such that they sideline the plot hugely and create a world where the jokes are more played out than the reality.

That and both the jokes and the "plot" are predictable as all hell.

I think my problem with House is that I've seen pretty much everything else that Hugh Laurie has done and it's all universally better.
And as others have mentioned his supporting characters are not that great. So I don't get that much out of it.

[Mirai Gen]

The reason I singled out Scrubs is because it takes the whole improbable punchlines and set up gags that are the features of American sitcom to an extreme, such that they sideline the plot hugely and create a world where the jokes are more played out than the reality.
I don't get how come you associate totally crazy, extreme jokes with sitcoms.

I mean, hell, for that matter it's off-the-wall Webcomic humor, like Slackerz or F@nboy$...hell, it's Monty Python humor, where the joke is where the world is normal and static, but then they do a JD Imagination Moment and make the joke completely crazy and off-the-wall.

Hell even if you're not talking about the JD Imagination, what isn't funny about Janitor, Cox, Kelso, or The Todd?

I really don't see what's so typical sitcom about it at all.

EDIT: On House, they're not always predictable. I remember the woman whom was pregnant and had lung cancer, that certainly wasn't predictable. And some episodes aren't even about finding the cure or the problem - in one episode they pegged the guy's dying heart really early, the episode was devoted to getting a heart for him in a short amount of time.

[Smarty McBarrelpants]

It's the classic difference between the American sitcom and the British sitcom in that the American sitcom is focused upon punchlines, generally in otherwise normal situations and often out of context with the rest of the scene, whereas the British sitcom is focused upon bizarre setups and characters to provide the humour, not forced punchlines.
Scrubs is very rote in this manner in that the dialogue is structured completely around building up to the punchlines.

You quoted Monty Python but htat has a completely different set up in that the focus was on ridiculous scenes and ridiculous characters and not on the delivery of jokes. In fact they even did a few parody sketches where they just built up to a punchline and they were purposefully terrible.

I think you are confusing the content of the joke with the actual setup and delivery of the joke.

[Seil]

See, BHS, this is why I made this thread. 'Cause of stuff like this. (http://forum.nuklearpower.com/showthread.php?t=28103)

[Mike McC]

Stop trying to derail the conversation into one of your threads. That's Greedy. Greedy boy.

And Barrel, Scrubs is full of Bizzare setups and how characters react to them. Granted, JD is most of the bizarre situations himself, but it's not heavily punchline centric as, say, Three And A Half Men. Really, all four of NBC's sitcoms are more centered around strange situations than just churning out the jokes. Though, I accept your "Hugh Laurie's other stuff is better", because yeah, can't argue with that.

[Seil]

This thread is my thread too, so I win both ways. Ha.

[Smarty McBarrelpants]

Stop trying to derail the conversation into one of your threads. That's Greedy. Greedy boy.

And Barrel, Scrubs is full of Bizzare setups and how characters react to them. Granted, JD is most of the bizarre situations himself, but it's not heavily punchline centric as, say, Three And A Half Men. Really, all four of NBC's sitcoms are more centered around strange situations than just churning out the jokes. Though, I accept your "Hugh Laurie's other stuff is better", because yeah, can't argue with that.

But there's a difference in the way the setups are used. In the British vein the setups are the joke. But in Scrubs the setup is not the joke. JD's fantasy sequences are a perfect example. They are one of the main types of jokes and they are typical punchlines, in that they remove the actual plot as funny and posit something else.
I think my use of 'Punchlines" is perhaps misleading. It doesn't have to be a witty retort but it has to be removed from the natural flow of dialogue/scene and has to is build up to, usually by dialogue.

And this is why Scrubs is the best example of the American sitcom, in that JD's fantasies are a stock perfect example of a punchlined humour.


And Seil that other thread doesn't apply because I don't know of anyone who actually watches Scrubs. I mean it rates pretty highly over here but I don't really know anyone who watches it.

[POS Industries]

And this is why Scrubs is the best example of the American sitcom, in that JD's fantasies are a stock perfect example of a punchlined humour.
No, no dude. That's not a textbook case of an American sitcom at all. There is no sitcom in the United States resembling it at all right now, except maybe Family Guy, and a few years back Titus relied rather heavily on some cutaway gags as well. However, most sitcoms are in the same vein as Two and a Half Men, Friends, Three's Company, etc.

I'm not even a huge fan of Scrubs but I'm well aware of the difference.

And Seil that other thread doesn't apply because I don't know of anyone who actually watches Scrubs. I mean it rates pretty highly over here but I don't really know anyone who watches it.
I'm assuming you don't know that many people.

[Mirai Gen]

And Seil that other thread doesn't apply because I don't know of anyone who actually watches Scrubs. I mean it rates pretty highly over here but I don't really know anyone who watches it.
I'm sure that you could just browse the Scrubs thread we had and find people whom also watch Scrubs that you don't know.

Count me in to start.

[Fifthfiend]

The title of this thread was plainly in error. It has been corrected.

[Smarty McBarrelpants]

No, no dude. That's not a textbook case of an American sitcom at all. There is no sitcom in the United States resembling it at all right now, except maybe Family Guy, and a few years back Titus relied rather heavily on some cutaway gags as well. However, most sitcoms are in the same vein as Two and a Half Men, Friends, Three's Company, etc.

I'm not even a huge fan of Scrubs but I'm well aware of the difference.



It's a textbook case of the key feature of American sitcoms which is the cutaway gag/disjointed punchline. They share the same conceptual space and that's why I use it as an example because otherwise people just think of "The Punchline" and don't think about the creative space that "The Punchline" represents and how using such a device sculpts the rest of the show.

And I must say some of my friends probably do watch Scrubs but we don't really talk about tv as most of us don't watch much of it. But I don't know of any who do.

And I heartily approve of our new title.

[POS Industries]

most of us don't watch much of it.
Yeah, see here's the thing.

You have made it clear that you are someone who doesn't watch a lot of television. Also, I am well aware that you live in New Zealand, so I'm guessing that neither American nor British television is the most commonly aired programming where you live. Therefore, there would likely be very little of either which you have seen in your lifetime with which to form an opinion.

You are then telling Americans, who have grown up watching American television, what the archetypal American sitcom is like, and all of those Americans are plainly telling you that you are incorrect.

What is the most likely truth here?

[Fifthfiend]

This thread is my thread too, so I win both ways. Ha.

That was actually pretty good.

[Smarty McBarrelpants]

Yeah, see here's the thing.

You have made it clear that you are someone who doesn't watch a lot of television. Also, I am well aware that you live in New Zealand, so I'm guessing that neither American nor British television is the most commonly aired programming where you live. Therefore, there would likely be very little of either which you have seen in your lifetime with which to form an opinion.

You are then telling Americans, who have grown up watching American television, what the archetypal American sitcom is like, and all of those Americans are plainly telling you that you are incorrect.

What is the most likely truth here?

Would you care to address my argument instead of me? Classic logical fallacy territory here.

But I will respond.

Firstly, as someone between British and American tv I am well placed to judge the differences between the two and the key makeups of each group.

Secondly I have training in literature analysis that most people don't have. You will claim that this does not relate to tv but it does in this case. Why? Because the key difference between British and American sitcoms lies in their overlying structure and the creative process involved in them, both of which are heavily related to the script and its construction.
I feel even more justified making this claim based upon the responses I am getting. You guys have been judging the show based merely upon its outward similarity to other shows which is not my argument at all. I am arguing it shares an intrinsic relation, based upon the dialogue (sort of like a creative mindspace) under which it was concieved. You continue to state that its different because of the nature of its humour but I'm saying this is completely irrelevant and what is important is the way the humour is presented and the way it relates to the rest of the script as a textual entity.

I'm seeing in the arguments I'm being presented a classic misattribution problem in that you are seeing the outcome of the joke or its style of presentation as the relation the joke has to the rest of the script.
And that's a mistake that can be made if you're American or if you're from New Zealand.

[Mike McC]

Structurally, I see a lot of britcoms that fit your criteria for the archetypical American Sitcom. And I should know, because I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express.

[Smarty McBarrelpants]

Well yes and some American sitcoms fit the British model. It's not a hard and fast divide across the Atlantic but they are varying schools which are mostly based in various sides.
Especially lately British sitcoms have become much more American in focus. I don't know why. Maybe people enjoy them more.

I'm not sure what your Holiday Inn express mention refers to.

[Mike McC]

Or maybe it's always been that way, and that devide is completely imaginary. Much like House's selflessness. Hah! Tied it back into the real topic.

[POS Industries]

Would you care to address my argument instead of me? Classic logical fallacy territory here.
I am addressing your argument. I'm pointing out that it's ill-informed and inaccurate and positing a hypothesis as to why based on previous statements by you both in and out of your actual argument.

Secondly I have training in literature analysis that most people don't have. You will claim that this does not relate to tv but it does in this case.
Haha, no I wouldn't.

Anyway, I'm not going to bother quoting the rest of the post because oh man is that ever long. I'm not saying that Scrubs is not a sitcom that isn't written in the American comedic mindset if you dissect it to its very core. What I'm saying is that it isn't the American sitcom archetype. It is not a perfect example of a stereotypical American comedy show outside of being a comedy show made by Americans for Americans.

There are archetypes. Full House, for instance, is probably the shining example of the archetypal American sitcom. Everything about Full House was the most generic American sitcom trope in the history of television.

Now aside from having jokes with a set-up and a punchline, there is no similarity between Scrubs and Full House. If Full House is the classic archetype and Scrubs is nothing like Full House, then Scrubs is not the archetype.

[Fifthfiend]

Full House was more the archetypal American family sitcom which is its own weird little subgenre.

You get a lot of extra shit in there like "very special" episodes and obligatory "single adult relative dating child's teacher" plotlines and shit that don't feature too heavily outside the genre. Similar to how Saved by the Bell would be the archetype for teen sitcoms but wouldn't necessarily apply to much outside of that.

RE: Scrubs I was going to comment and then I realized I've only ever seen two episodes of Scrubs. One and a half, really. There was something about a really well-decorated room that the janitor and head doctor were keeping secret? And then a toilet built into the roof?

I guess I can see BHS's point about American versus British punchlines because as I recall they mainly used the toilet on the roof for like a whole set-piece fantasism escapement thing whereas truly "British" comedy would have spent much more time exploring the fundamental weirdness of having a toilet on the roof.

[Mannix]

I'm not sure what your Holiday Inn express mention refers to.
It's from an advertisement for that particular hotel chain. The joke is that smart people stay at H.I.E., so if you stay at H.I.E. you're smart.

Full House was more the archetypal American family sitcom which is its own weird little subgenre.
Beat me to it. Family Matters is another good one. Good ole Steve Urkle.

[POS Industries]

Full House was more the archetypal American family sitcom which is its own weird little subgenre.
I'd argue that, with the bulk of American sitcoms in history being family-centric, that anything else would be the subgenre.

[Fifthfiend]

http://forum.nuklearpower.com/showthread.php?t=28235

I'm gonna say let's move the archetypes stuff over there, the House thread is getting a bit clogged.

...In case my use of my harsh-looking mod-color leads anybody to infer an angry tone I will clarify that is not my intent, this is purely a case of me highlighting so everybody sees this and is as such on the same page.

[greed]

On House and ontopic, back to this

Only if you're some kind of robot who does not know these things humans call feelings.

I do and I like them, but the House writers do not do emotional drama well outside of House himself. Hence the more reserved and cynical second trio are superior due the unlikelyness of degenerating into existential angst like Foreman, being annoying like Chase or just making my teeth fucking ache like Cameron. Taub's family drama and Kumar's immaturity are just going to make more interesting and believable stories. And 13's stoicism is far better than Cameron's alternating bleeding heart and self destructiveness. Though the Huntingtons does look like an angst bomb waiting to go off regrettably.


Also way to reference the best movie ever with the thread title Fifth.